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	<title>Comments on: A Fancy Greg Fischer Award Story Update</title>
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	<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/</link>
	<description>a critical take on Louisville news</description>
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		<title>By: Bill</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-108521</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Apr 2010 11:43:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-108521</guid>
		<description>As someone who has lived in this region 30 of my 35 years, people aren&#039;t going to move to Louisville just to see a park on the waterfront. They aren&#039;t going to move here because they have parks all over the city. What&#039;s going to bring people here is quality employment opportunities of a professional grade job market. Not a retail job market or a service industry low wage job market. 

As someone who wants to see the best for this region including higher wage jobs and more skilled employment opportunities so I don&#039;t have to move away to find work, I would rather see world class schools and schools that aren&#039;t garbage like what has been put at the Belknap campus. 

As far as the bridges go, they better figure out something to get two bridges built before we have a calamity where one of the existing bridges becomes unusable. I&#039;ve been all over town the past couple of weeks and the traffic is horrid coming from the Indiana side to Louisville because of the poorly engineered mess called Spaghetti Junction. Having a 20 lane system isn&#039;t going to fix things either unless you rebuild the interstate in a different location. None of which is going to make any community preservationist happy. 

The original I 65 plan was to have the interstate pass through the city in a more western approach and that would have taken it closer to the falls. So keeping it where it is isn&#039;t going to change.  Why we need to pave over the biggest part of Waterfront Park is beyond me but it seems to me that isn&#039;t the problem at all. The problem is getting traffic out of downtown and into downtown. 

You&#039;re not going to do it successfully with a urban parkway with stoplights every once in a while. Its going to back up just like the Kennedy Bridge does now and people trying to go east onto 64 and 71. 

The entire system as it stands now was a product of 1960s thinking especially the mess that is called on and off ramps. Would a cloverleaf had been better? Hard to tell because its all going to bottleneck. For some reason, people in this region have a problem with driving and its not that Louisville is a massive city say like Chicago or St. Louis Metro or Atlanta. 

I have to question why Mayor Jerry goes on these Possibility City outings trying to recruit people to move back here when he should damn well know that there is a paucity of paying employment in this town. If someone wants to come here and develop a business, go for it but for many people it makes absolutely no sense to move back here when in many cases they are doing well in places like Chicago, Dallas, Atlanta, San Fran, LA etc. They&#039;re going to come back to what?  A lower wage base, a broken school system, a city that can&#039;t even take care of its surface streets. I hate to be negative but the negatives of moving back here certainly outweigh the positives. 

Frankly, this site is a great place for people to discuss and share information.  Its much needed here as the news media in this city gives softball questions to the politicos and others. There is no real investigative journalism other than a few good sites that were created by the locals here.  Especially when it comes to mass readership and at least being able to get the news out there. 

The CJ has been defunct for years in that but thats another issue. Anyway, just my two cents. But if people in Louisville don&#039;t care enough to get things done and get the city repaired and improved, then nothing will change and it will still be the same city ran by the old stogy crowd that has kept things the same for generations. Let&#039;s hope people open their eyes and actually realize that we need paying jobs and good wages and quality of life issues. Parks by themselves don&#039;t cut it. There&#039;s plenty of open parks in the USA and you have to make a living and that&#039;s ultimately what counts</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who has lived in this region 30 of my 35 years, people aren&#8217;t going to move to Louisville just to see a park on the waterfront. They aren&#8217;t going to move here because they have parks all over the city. What&#8217;s going to bring people here is quality employment opportunities of a professional grade job market. Not a retail job market or a service industry low wage job market. </p>
<p>As someone who wants to see the best for this region including higher wage jobs and more skilled employment opportunities so I don&#8217;t have to move away to find work, I would rather see world class schools and schools that aren&#8217;t garbage like what has been put at the Belknap campus. </p>
<p>As far as the bridges go, they better figure out something to get two bridges built before we have a calamity where one of the existing bridges becomes unusable. I&#8217;ve been all over town the past couple of weeks and the traffic is horrid coming from the Indiana side to Louisville because of the poorly engineered mess called Spaghetti Junction. Having a 20 lane system isn&#8217;t going to fix things either unless you rebuild the interstate in a different location. None of which is going to make any community preservationist happy. </p>
<p>The original I 65 plan was to have the interstate pass through the city in a more western approach and that would have taken it closer to the falls. So keeping it where it is isn&#8217;t going to change.  Why we need to pave over the biggest part of Waterfront Park is beyond me but it seems to me that isn&#8217;t the problem at all. The problem is getting traffic out of downtown and into downtown. </p>
<p>You&#8217;re not going to do it successfully with a urban parkway with stoplights every once in a while. Its going to back up just like the Kennedy Bridge does now and people trying to go east onto 64 and 71. </p>
<p>The entire system as it stands now was a product of 1960s thinking especially the mess that is called on and off ramps. Would a cloverleaf had been better? Hard to tell because its all going to bottleneck. For some reason, people in this region have a problem with driving and its not that Louisville is a massive city say like Chicago or St. Louis Metro or Atlanta. </p>
<p>I have to question why Mayor Jerry goes on these Possibility City outings trying to recruit people to move back here when he should damn well know that there is a paucity of paying employment in this town. If someone wants to come here and develop a business, go for it but for many people it makes absolutely no sense to move back here when in many cases they are doing well in places like Chicago, Dallas, Atlanta, San Fran, LA etc. They&#8217;re going to come back to what?  A lower wage base, a broken school system, a city that can&#8217;t even take care of its surface streets. I hate to be negative but the negatives of moving back here certainly outweigh the positives. </p>
<p>Frankly, this site is a great place for people to discuss and share information.  Its much needed here as the news media in this city gives softball questions to the politicos and others. There is no real investigative journalism other than a few good sites that were created by the locals here.  Especially when it comes to mass readership and at least being able to get the news out there. </p>
<p>The CJ has been defunct for years in that but thats another issue. Anyway, just my two cents. But if people in Louisville don&#8217;t care enough to get things done and get the city repaired and improved, then nothing will change and it will still be the same city ran by the old stogy crowd that has kept things the same for generations. Let&#8217;s hope people open their eyes and actually realize that we need paying jobs and good wages and quality of life issues. Parks by themselves don&#8217;t cut it. There&#8217;s plenty of open parks in the USA and you have to make a living and that&#8217;s ultimately what counts</p>
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		<title>By: Stunoland</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107994</link>
		<dc:creator>Stunoland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 03:07:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107994</guid>
		<description>Jake, I think Louisville is lucky to have you because of your ability to dig for stories that our complacent traditional media misses. It would be a shame “If people in Louisville are stupid enough to want to ruin the city...&quot; and there is the possibility that you will &quot;...move away.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jake, I think Louisville is lucky to have you because of your ability to dig for stories that our complacent traditional media misses. It would be a shame “If people in Louisville are stupid enough to want to ruin the city&#8230;&#8221; and there is the possibility that you will &#8220;&#8230;move away.”</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Magruder</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107993</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Magruder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 03:06:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107993</guid>
		<description>Tandy may not directly be a River Fields guy, but it is clear that he&#039;s an Abramson acolyte and for whatever reason is adamant about ramming the two-bridges boondoggle down our throats.

On the other hand, while King has made some ridiculous statements about the bridges project in this campaign (like it&#039;s &quot;patriotic&quot; to build the second I-65 bridge), he&#039;s also someone who has demonstrated the ability to see all sides of issues and work chameleon-like to achieve ultimately what&#039;s in the best interests of the city.  I&#039;m not a supporter of his, but I&#039;m just saying I know his game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tandy may not directly be a River Fields guy, but it is clear that he&#8217;s an Abramson acolyte and for whatever reason is adamant about ramming the two-bridges boondoggle down our throats.</p>
<p>On the other hand, while King has made some ridiculous statements about the bridges project in this campaign (like it&#8217;s &#8220;patriotic&#8221; to build the second I-65 bridge), he&#8217;s also someone who has demonstrated the ability to see all sides of issues and work chameleon-like to achieve ultimately what&#8217;s in the best interests of the city.  I&#8217;m not a supporter of his, but I&#8217;m just saying I know his game.</p>
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		<title>By: Stunoland</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107985</link>
		<dc:creator>Stunoland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 02:38:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107985</guid>
		<description>Shannon White was on the build the bridges coalition before she resigned/was removed. what&#039;s the story on that? Now she is against the downtown part of the ORBP. Sour grapes or a legitimate 180 degree policy position change?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shannon White was on the build the bridges coalition before she resigned/was removed. what&#8217;s the story on that? Now she is against the downtown part of the ORBP. Sour grapes or a legitimate 180 degree policy position change?</p>
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		<title>By: jake</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107980</link>
		<dc:creator>jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 02:25:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107980</guid>
		<description>Nope.  I think I&#039;m lucky to have Louisville, not the other way around.

I&#039;m just a realist.  Tyler isn&#039;t going to win.  One of the other guys is.  Probably best to force one of the other guys to do the right thing or try to influence them.  Tandy and King aren&#039;t River Fields guys.

(Futher - Shannon White seems dumb as a rock when it comes to issues lie 64.  Lisa Moxley&#039;s response - if you watch her C-J ed board interview - is more balanced.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nope.  I think I&#8217;m lucky to have Louisville, not the other way around.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m just a realist.  Tyler isn&#8217;t going to win.  One of the other guys is.  Probably best to force one of the other guys to do the right thing or try to influence them.  Tandy and King aren&#8217;t River Fields guys.</p>
<p>(Futher &#8211; Shannon White seems dumb as a rock when it comes to issues lie 64.  Lisa Moxley&#8217;s response &#8211; if you watch her C-J ed board interview &#8211; is more balanced.)</p>
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		<title>By: Stunoland</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107974</link>
		<dc:creator>Stunoland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 02:05:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107974</guid>
		<description>I am not usually a single issue voter but in this election my single issue is the long term economic health of our city. In my opinion the downtown part of the Ohio River Bridges Project is the biggest urban planning mistake of the 21st century and will doom Louisville to a future of economic mediocrity. I care deeply about this city and do not want to move away but feel that as an entrepreneur I will be left with no choice: Louisville will not be able to compete for educated and creative workers if the ORBP, as currently planned, is allowed to be built. Do I require that every aspect of Tyler Allen&#039;s 8664 plan be institued for me to stay in Louisville? The answer is No. Personally I think a semi-limited access 6 lane, 45 MPH at-grade parkway with a block wide pedestrian overpass plaza next to Sluggerfield is a more pragmatic plan. Regardless of the solution, the crux of my argument is that most people are single issue voters. Their #1 issue is the long-term economic health of the city. Nothing will do more to harm the long-term economic health of the city than Louisville becoming the only city to ever expand an elevated waterfront expressway and placing a massive quadruple stacked L.A. style interchange on its image defining waterfront. The economic arguments against tolling are just the icing on the cake that elevates the ORBP to the status of the biggest urban planning mistake of the 21st century. I think you perfectly illustrated my argument when you stated &quot;If people in Louisville are stupid enough to want to ruin the city, let them. I’ll adapt or move away.&quot; I would guess that you think that you are a pretty talented guy and Louisville is lucky to have you. If there is an infrastructure project so bad that it leads you to believe you might leave a city, then that is a major problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am not usually a single issue voter but in this election my single issue is the long term economic health of our city. In my opinion the downtown part of the Ohio River Bridges Project is the biggest urban planning mistake of the 21st century and will doom Louisville to a future of economic mediocrity. I care deeply about this city and do not want to move away but feel that as an entrepreneur I will be left with no choice: Louisville will not be able to compete for educated and creative workers if the ORBP, as currently planned, is allowed to be built. Do I require that every aspect of Tyler Allen&#8217;s 8664 plan be institued for me to stay in Louisville? The answer is No. Personally I think a semi-limited access 6 lane, 45 MPH at-grade parkway with a block wide pedestrian overpass plaza next to Sluggerfield is a more pragmatic plan. Regardless of the solution, the crux of my argument is that most people are single issue voters. Their #1 issue is the long-term economic health of the city. Nothing will do more to harm the long-term economic health of the city than Louisville becoming the only city to ever expand an elevated waterfront expressway and placing a massive quadruple stacked L.A. style interchange on its image defining waterfront. The economic arguments against tolling are just the icing on the cake that elevates the ORBP to the status of the biggest urban planning mistake of the 21st century. I think you perfectly illustrated my argument when you stated &#8220;If people in Louisville are stupid enough to want to ruin the city, let them. I’ll adapt or move away.&#8221; I would guess that you think that you are a pretty talented guy and Louisville is lucky to have you. If there is an infrastructure project so bad that it leads you to believe you might leave a city, then that is a major problem.</p>
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		<title>By: jake</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107965</link>
		<dc:creator>jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 01:29:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107965</guid>
		<description>Stuno:  I&#039;m not a single-issue voter.  So I&#039;m not basing my entire life on 8664.  If people in Louisville are stupid enough to want to ruin the city, let them.  I&#039;ll adapt or move away.

I think Tyler&#039;s right on just about everything.  But there is, indeed, more to life than the Waterfront.

That said...  Tyler&#039;s not going to win.  It&#039;s not going to happen.  He&#039;s had all this time to make a move or talk about something else as much as he has about the bridges (I know they&#039;re important)...  and there&#039;s been no movement.  Not happening.

Greg Fischer is the current front-running with Jim King and David Tandy right behind him.  Tandy has no money but has unions to attack Fischer for him.  King has plenty of cash and will do his own attacking.  Fischer will hit back here and there but his problems are greater than the other candidates.  It&#039;ll be a super-close race.  And it&#039;ll take King &amp; Tandy working together to defeat Fischer.

If Fischer wins in the primary, Heiner wins in the general.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stuno:  I&#8217;m not a single-issue voter.  So I&#8217;m not basing my entire life on 8664.  If people in Louisville are stupid enough to want to ruin the city, let them.  I&#8217;ll adapt or move away.</p>
<p>I think Tyler&#8217;s right on just about everything.  But there is, indeed, more to life than the Waterfront.</p>
<p>That said&#8230;  Tyler&#8217;s not going to win.  It&#8217;s not going to happen.  He&#8217;s had all this time to make a move or talk about something else as much as he has about the bridges (I know they&#8217;re important)&#8230;  and there&#8217;s been no movement.  Not happening.</p>
<p>Greg Fischer is the current front-running with Jim King and David Tandy right behind him.  Tandy has no money but has unions to attack Fischer for him.  King has plenty of cash and will do his own attacking.  Fischer will hit back here and there but his problems are greater than the other candidates.  It&#8217;ll be a super-close race.  And it&#8217;ll take King &#038; Tandy working together to defeat Fischer.</p>
<p>If Fischer wins in the primary, Heiner wins in the general.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Magruder</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107957</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Magruder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 01:05:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107957</guid>
		<description>I would be ultimately be all right with anyone running, except Fischer and Tandy (Mayor Jer&#039;s Ugly Stepchildren), as well as Farnsley and Marshall.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would be ultimately be all right with anyone running, except Fischer and Tandy (Mayor Jer&#8217;s Ugly Stepchildren), as well as Farnsley and Marshall.</p>
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		<title>By: Stunoland</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107952</link>
		<dc:creator>Stunoland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 00:43:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107952</guid>
		<description>You would be ok with Jim King, Hal Heiner, or David Tandy winning and destroying Louisville&#039;s image and economy with their misguided support for the entire Ohio River Bridges Plan? Tyler is 24 points behind today with a lot of people still undecided. Hopefully Greg Fischer&#039;s dishonesty will turn off some of his supporters who will then break for Tyler. Unlikely yes, but stranger things have certainly happened in politics before.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You would be ok with Jim King, Hal Heiner, or David Tandy winning and destroying Louisville&#8217;s image and economy with their misguided support for the entire Ohio River Bridges Plan? Tyler is 24 points behind today with a lot of people still undecided. Hopefully Greg Fischer&#8217;s dishonesty will turn off some of his supporters who will then break for Tyler. Unlikely yes, but stranger things have certainly happened in politics before.</p>
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		<title>By: jake</title>
		<link>http://thevillevoice.com/2010/04/23/a-fancy-greg-fischer-award-story-update/comment-page-1/#comment-107941</link>
		<dc:creator>jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2010 00:14:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thevillevoice.com/?p=5418#comment-107941</guid>
		<description>How do you know I don&#039;t support Tyler Allen, who also has no chance?

The only candidate I don&#039;t support is Greg Fischer.  I&#039;d be okay with any other victor - including Hal Heiner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How do you know I don&#8217;t support Tyler Allen, who also has no chance?</p>
<p>The only candidate I don&#8217;t support is Greg Fischer.  I&#8217;d be okay with any other victor &#8211; including Hal Heiner.</p>
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